RE: [jox] New Draft CFP
- From: "Mathieu O'Neil" <mathieu.oneil anu.edu.au>
- Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:16:03 +1000
Hi stefan, all
Re list of topics:
- OK for "pp and feminism"
- OK for "pp ethics"
- re. "pp and limited natural resources": what is missing then perhaps is
the kind of society that industry creates. So what about "pp and industrial
society" - there is so much talk about how we are "post-industrial" these
days which strikes me as a bit misguided and this would serve to point that
out, though it leaves out ecology, lets see: how about "pp, industry and
From: owner-journal oekonux.org [owner-journal oekonux.org] On Behalf
Of Stefan Merten
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 6:58 PM
To: journal oekonux.org
Cc: Stefan Merten
Subject: Re: [jox] New Draft CFP
Hi Mathieu and all!
4 days ago Mathieu O'Neil wrote:
NOT SHOUTING - BRIEF REPLIES IN CAPS WHERE REQUIRED.
BTW: I think this clear statement clarifies many concerns about the
direction of the journal :-) .
WELL, I ALSO UNDERSTAND IN A BROADER SENSE - AS IN "ENVISIONING RESEARCH
JUST IN TERMS OF THE ACTUAL BUT ALSO THE POSSIBLE" - A CONCERN FOR SOCIAL
JUSTICE, AGAINST SOCIAL DOMINATION... DOES NOT HAVE TO BE MARX / FRANKFURT
SCHOOL EVEN IF THOSE APPROACHES ARE USEFUL.
I think we are on the same page.
- peer production and expertise: I mean the different relationships to
specialised knowledge in peer projects (Wikipedia vs. Free Software for
example) and the relationship to traditional holders of learned authority
(academia, media, government experts etc)
I understood expertise as a special ability not everyone has. In fact
it is quite interesting that in contemporary examples of peer
production special abilities are often needed - i.e. expertise. If I
get your right then your point is more some sort of title? That is
indeed rather uncommon to be very useful in peer production. May be we
could be more precise here but may be it is only my lack of English
showing through here.
NO, I WAS REFERRING TO HOW SOME PROJECTS ARE OPEN TO ALL WHEREAS OTHERS
REQUIRE SPECIAL EXPERTISE, OR HOW THERE CAN BE INEQUALITY IN OPEN PROJECTS
BECAUSE OF IMBALANCE IN EXPERTISE / TECHNICAL COMPETENCE BETWEEN
See my notes about equality below.
- In addition: I took out "forms and function" as this was already in the
mission statement in the first para. And I added feminism and growth.
Feminism and growth are both particular capitalist topics - though the
value sets attached may be more general. Again I suggest to be more
general here. Something like "peer production and capitalist moral" or
so. On the other hand I think feminism is covered already by "peer
production and social movements".
I DISAGREE THAT GROWTH IS WITHIN CAPITALISM - SOME PEOPLE WOULD ARGUE THAT
HAVING AN INDUSTRIAL SYSTEM OF GROWTH IS A MORE SERIOUS PROBLEM THAN
A CAPITALIST SYSTEM AS EVERYONE WANTS IT (EVEN ANTI-CAPITALISTS) AND IT IS
DESTROYING THE PLANET AND RENDERING EVERYONE DEPENDENT ON TECHNICIANS AND
THE TECHNICAL SYSTEM..
Well, the question is why this is so. But I can see your point. To put
it differently the point would be: "Peer production and limited
natural ressources". Right? This is certainly a valid and useful
point. May be we can put it this way?
AS FOR FEMINISM IT IS NOT USUALLY CONSIDERED A "SOCIAL MOVEMENT" ANY MORE.
HAVE SOME VAGUE AWARENESS OF YOUR POINT OF HOW IS USED IN CAPITALISM BUT
FRANKLY THE SITUATION OF WOMEN WORLDWIDE IS SO BAD STILL THAT IT IS A MOOT
POINT IN MY VIEW. WE HAVE TO BE CLEAR WHERE WE STAND ON THIS: FOR EQUALITY
BETWEEN GENDERS, THAT IS WHY I PUT IT.
Well, equality to me is part of the capitalist value set. In
capitalism I'm all for it but I'm trying to think beyond this value
set. And frankly I don't know which role abstract equality like this
will play in a peer production based society. The key question for me
is rather how to make a good life for everyone possible. This may
include equality but to me it is also possible that this topic is
transcended somehow in a new society.
But it's ok with me to have this topic.
Well, this brings me to a new idea: What about a topic like "Peer
production ethics"? That would probably be my point of interest as
just outlined and certainly an interesting question. What do you
AFAICS the discussion is still fruitful. Insofar I'd not stop it now
but wait until no comments are coming any more. For *this* a deadline
may be useful, however.
ALL RIGHT - END OF THIS MONTH? OR LATER? 15 SEPTEMBER?
Fine with me.