Re: Peer governance (was: Re: [ox-en] Terminology: Peer X?)
- From: Michael Bauwens <michelsub2003 yahoo.com>
- Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2008 04:02:25 -0800 (PST)
Hi Stefan,
I'm not sure what exactly is the wishful thinking you refer to, if I understand correctly, with Christian's position here in this context. Thanks for elaborating,
Michel
----- Original Message ----
From: Stefan Merten <smerten oekonux.de>
To: list-en oekonux.org
Cc: Stefan Merten <smerten oekonux.de>
Sent: Friday, February 1, 2008 12:59:55 AM
Subject: Peer governance (was: Re: [ox-en] Terminology: Peer X?)
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Hi
Christian
and
all!
2
months
(62
days)
ago
Michael
Bauwens
wrote:
one
of
the
most
famous
experts
on
governance,
bob
jessop,
includes
self-organization
under
governance
....
decision-making,
consensus,
all
these
form
part
of
governance,
even
if
the
community
'governs
itself'
...
Generally
I
agree
with
Michel's
explanation
that
governance
as
a
notion
describes
a
phenomenon.
That's
pretty
much
the
correct
term
of
what
I
called
OHA
(German,
translated:
Organization,
Domination,
Anarchy)
some
time
ago
(and
for
which
there
seems
to
be
no
good
word
in
German,
especially
because
"Herrschaft"
being
the
technical
term
for
it
is
not
accepted
in
general).
However,
I
sense
a
lot
of
wishful
thinking
here.
2
months
(63
days)
ago
Christian
Siefkes
wrote:
Stefan
Merten
wrote:
4
days
ago
Christian
Siefkes
wrote:
But
I
would
be
careful
about
attaching
a
new
prefix
to
old
terms,
since
the
old
terms
might
not
just
give
up
their
old
meaning.
There
is
a
reason
we
talk
about
"presidents",
not
about
"democratic
kings".
Therefore,
I
don't
talk
about
"peer
governance"
in
my
book,
but
simply
about
"decision
making
and
conflict
resolution",
since
I
think
that
these
are
the
two
aspects
of
governance
that
remain
relevant
in
a
peer
context,
while
other
aspects
of
governance-as-we-know-it-today
no
longer
matter.
But
that's
also
true
for
production,
isn't
it?
Or
wouldn't
you
think
that
sweat
shops
-
which
are
typical
for
some
of
today
production
processes
-
would
vanish?
Yup.
But
let's
look
at
the
definitions
of
these
terms
(from
dictionary.com):
gov·ern·ance
1.
government;
exercise
of
authority;
control.
2.
a
method
or
system
of
government
or
management.
pro·duc·tion
1.
the
act
of
producing;
creation;
manufacture.
...
pro·duce
1.
to
bring
into
existence;
give
rise
to;
cause.
2.
to
bring
into
existence
by
intellectual
or
creative
ability.
3.
to
make
or
manufacture.
...
I
don't
think
that
"government",
"exercise
of
authority",
or
"control"
are
adequate
terms
for
the
decision
making
and
conflict
resolution
processes
we
can
observe
in
free
software/free
culture
products,
and
even
"management"
sounds
a
bit
far-fetched.
Sorry,
but
I
strongly
disagree.
What
would
you
call
it
if
a
maintainer
in
a
Free
Software
project
decides
something
where
no
decision
comes
about
from
itself?
That's
clearly
"exercise
of
authority".
If
the
maintainer
would
not
have
this
authority
s/he
would
not
be
able
to
be
maintainer
at
all.
I
mean
it
makes
a
difference
if
a
maintainer
says
something
or
-
for
instance
-
a
troll.
And
that
is
good.
Also
for
"control".
Please
note:
In
English
the
term
"control"
means
steering
just
as
much
as
checking
(in
German
the
steering
component
is
not
contained
in
"Kontrolle").
And
a
maintainer
certainly
has
a
steering
function
in
a
project.
May
be
that's
even
the
most
important
one.
But
this
also
means
control
in
the
checking
sense.
Linus
-
or
the
kernel
developers
as
a
group
-
don't
simply
accept
any
patch
which
comes
in
but
control
it
for
a
number
of
criteria.
If
you
look
at
Wikipedia
meanwhile
you
have
a
number
or
checking
rules
which
are
applied.
Whether
they
are
good
or
bad
is
a
different
question
strongly
related
to
the
goal
of
the
project.
And
no,
that's
not
a
defect
in
peer
projects.
It's
the
way
things
have
developed
and
I
think
it
developed
very
well.
People
like
it
and
exactly
this
is
a
point
where
I
wholeheartedly
*love*
that
peer
projects
are
not
political
projects.
I
saw
countless
political
projects
which
applied
this
type
of
wishful
thinking
you
seem
to
follow
and
which
died
exactly
thereof.
Again
the
major
difference
here
is
that
no
alienated
interests
are
involved
in
peer
governance.
Maintainers
of
peer
projects
are
foremost
interested
in
the
project
-
or
they
are
not
accepted
as
maintainers
any
longer.
They
need
to
follow
the
project
goals
and
exactly
this
is
why
people
follow
them.
No
other
reason.
This
is
also
the
reason
why
corporations
are
constantly
suspected
and
have
a
hard
time
as
maintainers.
As
far
as
the
term
"government"
is
concerned
in
general
the
same
applies
though
to
me
it
sounds
more
like
an
embodied
institution.
I'm
not
so
sure
here
because
alienation
might
be
already
be
embedded
in
the
notion.
On
the
other
hand,
the
definitions
of
"produce"
and
"production"
seem
to
fit
quite
well.
That's
why
I
would
use
these
latter
terms
in
a
peer
context,
but
not
the
former
one.
Sorry,
I
totally
disagree.
I
understand
that
you
are
following
those
dreams
which
are
so
common
among
a
big
leftist
current
-
and
in
which
I
also
believed
for
such
a
long
time.
Peer
production
projects
and
many
other
occasions
in
my
less
virtual
live
told
me
differently.
I
agree
it
is
hard
to
let
down
this
perspective,
but
as
you
do
you
suddenly
see
the
world
with
different
eyes.
And
a
lot
of
things
stop
looking
simply
mysterious...
Grüße
Stefan
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