Message 02842 [Homepage] [Navigation]
Thread: oxenT02752 Message: 13/123 L8 [In index]
[First in Thread] [Last in Thread] [Date Next] [Date Prev]
[Next in Thread] [Prev in Thread] [Next Thread] [Prev Thread]

Re: [ox-en] New economic model for free technology?

Hi Michael,

in this debate we really work with many unknown factors.
that makes it interesting, but also difficult:

A full basic
income  seems unlikely at present, but may be the
result of a major crisis (just as the universal
suffrage and the welfare state had to wait major

As I pointed out, the problem with basic income is that it requires an
enormous value transfer from a productive business sector to the
distributing agency.

but this is precisely why we have peer to peer
realising use value, and why the basic income is
needed. In the western countries, there seems to be no
fundamental funding problem.

im my eye it is not possible to transfer use-value in the same way you
transfer money. As you say correctly, the peer-to-peer economy is based on
the enormous distribution of "capital" in form of computers and
decentralised means of production. If we choose to call this
"value-creation" at least this type of "value" cannot be material of
funding by the state. This is "value" which is "already there", but not
value in the sense of "possibility to command social wealth", to use
aggregated social power as a thing that we can possess and enact and

As I said: my fundamental point is that that this is exactly our problem:
that the productive power of the individual is rising whereas the
productive power of capital to produce and realize value
(labor-money-means of production-labour-more value) is dramatically
shrinking. But only the latter "value" can be dealt with by the state. (by
taxation mainly)

You are right, the state is still incredibly rich, but it is limiting its
people at the same time because the mechanism of value-generation needs
more care than ever, and so we increasingly "burn the violines" to feed
the economy instead of doing it the other way round. That is what
generated the need for basic income in the first place: that more and more
people are set aside by the economy which is simply demanding for more and
more productivity from öless and less people. The catch is you always need
a successful economy to guarantee basic income. 

 Out of peer-to-peer activities there comes no revenue and no taxes. It is
that simple.

later more.


Contact: projekt

Thread: oxenT02752 Message: 13/123 L8 [In index]
Message 02842 [Homepage] [Navigation]