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Re: [ox-en] Difference between Physical and Information production

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I should mention Gordon Pask's "Heinz von Foerster's Self-Organization,
the Progenitor of Conversation and Interaction Theories", in this context.

 - Smári

Michel Bauwens wrote:
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Hi Stefan,

please note that when we are talking  about craftmanship, we are NOT talking
about 'common sense' craftmanship of the 19th, but about the possibility of
localized, more customized production using the latest in technology

You should have a look at Kevin Carson's Organization Theory, a really good
study showing the weaknesses of the industrial model in terms of
sustainability, and how the full force of state intervention is needed to
keep it viable

I also notice you are not informed about recent comparative studies on
organic/sustainable  vs. industrial agriculture, so here is some material

First, here is what happens when you step away from the industrial model:

"While 25% of projects reported relative yields > 2.0,
(i.e. 100% increase), half of all the projects had yield increases of
between 18% and 100%. The
geometric mean is a better indicator of the average for such data with a
positive skew, but this still
shows a 64% increase in yield."


 Organic farming can feed the world, U-M study
PEOPLE  22 <>
 Organic farming can yield up to three times as much food on individual
farms in developing countries, as low-intensive methods on the same
land—according to new findings which refute the long-standing claim that
organic farming methods cannot produce enough food to feed the global

Researchers from the University of Michigan found that in developed
countries, yields were almost equal on organic and conventional farms. In
developing countries, food production could double or triple using organic

covering that specific argument:

 small farms are more productive per
PEOPLE  2 <>
 small farms produce far more per acre or hectare than large farms. One
reason for the low levels of production on large farms is that they tend to
be monocultures. The highest yield of a single crop is often obtained by
planting it alone on a field. But while that may produce a lot of one crop,
it generates nothing else of use to the farmer. In fact, the bare ground
between crop rows invites weed infestation. The weeds then make the farmer
invest labor in weeding or money in herbicide.

food supply: small farms generate $1,400 per acre; large farms only $39 an
acre - Global Swadeshi<>
  Small is Beautiful: Evidence of Inverse Size Yield Relationship in Rural
Turkey <>
PEOPLE  3 <>
 A strong inverse-size relationship between farm size and yield is prevalent
in all seven regions of Turkey even though heterogeneity among households
and regions is considered.

And more

  The Green Revolution Saved Lives? A Poison Meme That Just Won’t
PEOPLE  2 <>
 the prevailing techniques of American agribusiness have focuses on the
substitution of capital for labor, in order to increase output per man-hour
and reduce the agency problems of labor—even at the cost of reduced output
per acre. And small-scale operations, accordingly, tend to have both lower
outputs per labor-hour and higher outputs per acre than large ones. What’s
more, it’s simply incontrovertible that the most intensive organic
techniques produce far more per acre than conventional agribusiness. For
example, John Jeavons’ raised bed technique can feed one person on a minimum
of 4000 sq. ft. That’s one tenth of an acre. And it’s done, by the way,
without cattle manure or additional land for foraging them.

  Fatal Harvest - The Tragedy of Industrial Agriculture « Ukiah Blog
PEOPLE  4 <>
 Dave Smith is excerpting from a book that exposes the big lies about
Industrial Agriculture. "World hunger is not created by lack of food but by
poverty and landlessness, which deny people access to food. Industrial
agriculture actually increases hunger by raising the cost of farming, by
forcing tens of millions of farmers off the land, and by growing primarily
high-profit export and luxury crops."

  Famine Futures: Deregulated
the agricultural markets are broken after neoliberal reforms, writes
former banker, and hunger is nearly inevitable

On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 1:59 AM, Stefan Merten <smerten> wrote:

Hi Patrick, Diego, Michel, Markus, Franz, all!

@Patrick: Thanks for changing the subject :-) .

6 days ago Michel Bauwens wrote:
perhaps if the open hardware movement takes route, and starts
not just what we make, but also how we make it, there might be a return
craftsmanship ...
I strongly hope this won't be the case - given a common understanding
of the word craftsmanship.

a lot of repetitive tasks are linked to the current industrial model,
No. They are linked to exchange based systems where you have
incentives external to the actual work. If you can coerce people
structurally to do boring tasks then there is no need to remove them.

there's evidence that peopled liked to work on crafts and gardening in
As a hobby: Yes. As a basis of an economy: Definitely no. The
productivity (i.e. output per human effort) of the industrial system
must be improved upon to make generalized peer production a reality.
Applying craftsmanship in the common sense is clearly counter
productive for that.

It's a little comparable to organic agriculture, which is, if I'm not
mistaken, on average more than 20% more productive (in food per acre)_
green-revolution-industrial-agriculture (which is more productive in $
man-hour), and thus gets de-selected by the coercive overall system.
I'd be astonished if this would be the case. Sounds more like one of
those primitivists' myths.

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