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Re: [ox-en] Please stop damaging the project!

Hi lists!

One further clarification seems necessary here and also another couple
of notes.

The following paragraph raised a lot of misunderstanding. Actually
when composing the mail I rewrote it several times but as it seems I
were not able to transport what I meant.

3 days ago Stefan Merten wrote:
But is is completely off-topic to witch-hunt people in the way it is
happening here.

These were the things I considered with hunting:

  4 days ago Martin Hardie wrote:
  > So are you the Nazi??


  From: Martin Hardie <auskadi>
  To: list-en
  Subject: Re: [ox-en] Walther
  Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:02:13 +0200

The second example was the mail were the subject was changed to the
name of the person. As I noticed while checking through my unread mail
this seems to be a common behavior meanwhile:

  From: Martin Hardie <auskadi>
  To: list-en
  Subject: [ox-en] Mako and Plagiarism - or in future do your own work mate ....
  Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:20:00 +0200

I guess there were more such things but I leave it up to you to
consider this.

If you feel accused I'd recommend a simple test: If you feel treated
correctly, decently and reasonable when approached in the way you did
then your action is probably ok. If not - think again.

Stalinist show processes are also completely against
the spirit of Oekonux.

Ah - I just learned that law-suit is the right term instead of process
here. Sorry.

Bits like these made me think we are having some sort of law-suit

  4 days ago Martin Hardie wrote:
  > It really does make the case very strongly against
  > Walther.

  3 days ago Robin Green wrote:
  > So why on Sat Feb 9 2002 did you falsely claim that "Canada's highest
  > court found that Zundel was telling the truth and dismissed all charges
  > against him." ( )

And the way it was done reminded me much more of Stalinist show
law-suits than of an emancipatory way of overcoming the bourgeoise
juridical system. What would you say if a bourgeoise judge would act
that way?

Again: If you want to be treated that way in a similar case then there
is probably no problem with what you did. Otherwise think again.

Please also note that I did not call anyone a Stalinist or a witch
hunter. I just wanted to label some sort of behavior. I'm sorry if I
was unclear on that.

They are an all too well-known expression of
some parts of the left. However, please remember Oekonux is *NOT* a
left project. It can be considered trans-left and Stalinist show
processes and witch hunting are among those things Oekonux left
behind. I strongly ask every witch hunter on this list and every
Stalinist judge to comply to this or otherwise leave the list.

Obviously this has been understood by some persons as if I want
leftists to be excluded here. From reading this again I still can't
see how this interpretation works. Perhaps I should have mentioned
that Oekonux is an open project - which too me - quite obviously -
means to include leftists.

What I wanted to express was this: If you come from a left tradition
and the behavior I described above to you seems acceptable or even
necessary then please notice that things are a bit different in
Oekonux. I think this is good this way and I'm quite convinced that
most people on this list, which are regularly shocked by the behavior
I described above, agree with me that this should not take place here.
It destroys the atmosphere and the culture on this list and this is
the worst thing that can happen.

Please note that I have witnessed the decline of a number of good
(leftists) projects during the past 15 years. A lot of them if not all
started with behavior like this spreading out like wild fire. My
conclusion is that this is damaging to projects - though there are
also deeper thoughts about this. This is why I wanted to stop it.
Again I'm grateful this worked after all and at the moment I'm pretty
sure we get this resolved.

Please note despite of what I said about one or two weeks I started a
thread on [pox] to clarify this issue:

I hope I could point out that matters are not as simple as they seem
to some of you. If you want to comment this you can do by sending mail


at best with the subject

	Re: [pox] Please kick and ban Jonathan Walther for racism

so they are hopefully included in the threaded archive and thus
available easily. [pox] is open for postings from non-subscribers as
all Oekonux lists are.

I for one know that this topic is a rather emotional one for some
people here. So you need not point out this any more ;-) .
Constructive suggestions are most welcome, however.

Another note while I'm at it: Please stop cross-posting to lists not
related to Oekonux. Cross-posting is confusing. If you think there is
relevant material on other lists then then please forward it here
instead of cross-posting it. Also I guess the "new posters" come
mainly from this cross-posting (I didn't check).

						Mit Freien Grüßen


PS: One personal note: I'm really trying to make the best of the
situation. I'm always ready to admit that I make mistakes. Everyone
who does something is in danger of making mistakes. If you think I -
or others - do something wrong then please come up with constructive
alternative suggestions on [pox]. There things can mature and
hopefully we all will have a good harvest.

PPS: Also please note I'm also just a human. I also have feelings and
a personal history which show through once in a while. Sorry for this.

Organization: projekt

Thread: oxenT02277 Message: 15/17 L1 [In index]
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